the following is from a listing i randomly glanced at on facebook. the asking price made me nearly choke. is this seriously what these things are going for? i was just curious about it's price, i'm not in the market for a car.

$25,000 - 1995 Mitsubishi 3000 GT VR-4 Spyder
Listed by Joe Rollar on December 27th.
For Sale - Cars | 80 views
Condition: used

Red 3000 GT Twin Turbo V6 320+ HP Hardtop Convertible. 6 CD changer, AWD, Top works Perfect. Very Fast Car
Listed at:

UNC Greensboro
Tampa Bay, FL

yea the prices of 3000gt's are beyond over inflated, check them out on ebay

overweight, unreliable, and slow comes at a premium.

Thats so rare because it's a spyder, 1 year only convertible 3kgt. Like 2000 made that's it. I bought my 3kgt moderately modded for 7k. It's all about finding a good deal.

The convertibles do take quite a premium over the coupes.

like you guys rarity was the only thing i could come up with as a guess for why he is asking for so much, but even at that...come on...it's a mitsubishi. sad thing is i think i've seen this guy driving it around at school sometimes and from what i've seen he treats it like crap.

like you guys rarity was the only thing i could come up with as a guess for why he is asking for so much, but even at that...come on...it's a mitsubishi. sad thing is i think i've seen this guy driving it around at school sometimes and from what i've seen he treats it like crap.
It's not a guess, rarity is the reason they are so expensive. And he's really not asiking alot I've seen people asking in the 30's for them... the same price they were new lol.

And he's really not asiking alot
yes he is anyone that tries to sell a 3kgt for over 10 grand is asking way too much

lol. apparently my roommate said the guy is in band with him and that he's a pretty big douche haha.

Are you kidding me $25,000 is nothing for that car. A toyota supra TT goes for $25,000 even with a 100K miles, and a VR4 Spyder, um lets see Twin Turboed, AWD, 6 Speed, Hard Top Convertible, Very rare car, you'd have to be absolutely ignorant or just plain stupid to think its not worth anything more than $20,000.

Oh and for the loser that drives around in a 95 Celica GT, thinking your big and bad, you call 3000GT overpriced, heavy, slow cars, I got plenty of VR4's that will have your car still at the starting line by the time they reach 1/8 mile. You have no idea what your talking about, your a disgrace to moderate on this forum. for someone who is so ill knowledged and speaks out of his a** about a platform he has no knowledge on.

Also for the comment for a 3kGT selling over $10,000 is too much, I'm not even going to argue that because well basically you drive a CRX, anything that costs over $500 is too much for you.

Someone's got a little sand in his diaper... I would honestly try and get to know people before you bag on them. You missed the mark entirely.

I'm not here to start a flame thread, and start a cyber geek war, but all I am saying is that its pretty ignorant to make bold statements that all 3KGT are overpriced when you no close to nothing about the platform, I could sit here and basically talk shi* about evert make and model car ever made, but if I was going to I'd hope to have enough brains to know a thing or two about the car before I start running my mouth and ill-informing other members of these forums about a car you know nothing about.

The blue book value for a VR4 spyder is in the 24,000 up range, its not just cause there rare, but vr4 spyder was the most advanced car for its time, and is still one of the most reputable supercars to be released in the 90's from Japan.

I'm not here to start a flame thread, and start a cyber geek war, but all I am saying is that its pretty ignorant to make bold statements that all 3KGT are overpriced when you no close to nothing about the platform, I could sit here and basically talk shi* about evert make and model car ever made, but if I was going to I'd hope to have enough brains to know a thing or two about the car before I start running my mouth and ill-informing other members of these forums about a car you know nothing about.

The blue book value for a VR4 spyder is in the 24,000 up range, its not just cause there rare, but vr4 spyder was the most advanced car for its time, and is still one of the most reputable supercars to be released in the 90's from Japan.
how do you know that I know nothing about the 3kgt platform? Did you scan my mind to check for the info?

and regardless of what any price GUIDE says they are overpriced.

The blue book value for a VR4 spyder is in the 24,000 up range, its not just cause there rare, but vr4 spyder was the most advanced car for its time, and is still one of the most reputable supercars to be released in the 90's from Japan.
:headscrat

Also for the comment for a 3kGT selling over $10,000 is too much, I'm not even going to argue that because well basically you drive a CRX, anything that costs over $500 is too much for you.
its not a great car and I dont drive a crx, oh and im the one that doesnt know anything :eyeroll:

looks like we got another :chad:

i'm almost certain that car is on tamparacing.com

:headscrat
this is the part hat needed the boldfacing

The blue book value for a VR4 spyder is in the 24,000 up range, its not just cause there rare, but vr4 spyder was the most advanced car for its time, and is still one of the most reputable supercars to be released in the 90's from Japan.

how do you know that I know nothing about the 3kgt platform? Did you scan my mind to check for the info?

and regardless of what any price GUIDE says they are overpriced.

Well the only reason I say you have no idea what your babbling about is because its overpriced, you guys call the 3kGT slow, the car was running mid 13's straight out of the factory for under 40K in the 90's, where as some 100K lambo's and ferraris were still touching low to mid 13's.

The 3KGT is heavy? What a whole 250-300 lbs lighter than a supra big whoop. Yeah the supra is lighter but take in mind the AWD luxury, and the insane launches the 6G72 is capable of, this is why stock vs stock 3KGT and supra were neck in neck, but it no means was it slow, considering it came with 320HP stock right out of the factory and with a simple boost mod could be raised 2-3lbs of boost, giving up to 350HP.

Unreliable? Any sports car that is beat on is unreliable, even a honda or toyota. It's all about buying a well maintained car, yes like any platform the 3KGT did have its drawbacks and minor problems but to call it unreliable and a POS shows you know nothing about the platform.

Are you kidding me $25,000 is nothing for that car.
$25,000 is never "nothing", J.P. Moneybags.

A toyota supra TT goes for $25,000 even with a 100K miles, and a VR4 Spyder, um lets see Twin Turboed, AWD, 6 Speed, Hard Top Convertible, Very rare car, you'd have to be absolutely ignorant or just plain stupid to think its not worth anything more than $20,000.
toyota supra TT's are over-hyped, and therefore, over-priced. i did not know the spyders were rare. well, i'll be.

for your information, a car is only ever "worth" what someone will pay for it.

Oh and for the loser that drives around in a 95 Celica GT, thinking your big and bad, you call 3000GT overpriced, heavy, slow cars, I got plenty of VR4's that will have your car still at the starting line by the time they reach 1/8 mile.
chyea nigga! i's big an' bad all up in deez forumsss!! i called the Mitsu GTO overpriced, heavy, and slow. and i will continue to stand by my words. get over it?

don't care about y0 VRfoah's. lol @ you making assumptions about how i view my lil celi.

You have no idea what your talking about, your a disgrace to moderate on this forum.
:crybaby:

then don't pay attention to me, ever. whatever you say doesn't change the fact that i do help moderate CF, and... you don't. enjoy the board. you don't have to deal with what goes on behind the scenes so don't concern yourself with them.

for someone who is so ill knowledged and speaks out of his a** about a platform he has no knowledge on.
...yes? gonna finish that?

The 3KGT is heavy?
uh-huh. most GT cars are a bit plump. you know what a GT car is, right? it's not a true "sports car", because it compromises.

about 3780 pounds, right?
http://consumerguideauto.howstuffworks.com/1991-to-1999-mitsubishi-3000gt-4.htm

Unreliable?
yessir.

http://www.mitsubishisucks.com/cars/recalls/usa/3000gt.html

that ain't ignorance talking. it's facts. Mitsu did issue many recalls for that vehicle. and NHTSA does have records of them.


i don't hate the car, dude. i think it looks sweet when cleaned up and would probably be more than decent if someone else built it. if you still want to type angry posts after this, go on. i don't care what you say, because it isn't important. God bless you, have a nice day.

Trust me, I drive a Vr-4, with upwards of 430 HP. I run low 12's and have seen mid 11's with drag radials. The car is definitely overweight, and the transmission (both the 5 and 6 speed) isn't a very reliable peice of work, nor is the transfer case. But it is fun to drive and does look very nice right after a bath. I personally would never pay more than 10k for one, nor will I buy another when I'm through with this one. Appealing to those who are unknowledgeable about cars, but the more I learn and absorb, the more I wish I had bought something with more potential.

VR4s have potential but they are not reliable, are overpriced for what you get, a BITCH to work on and overweight,

Look at the guy above me 430 and only running low 11s. That means the car is ****in PORTLY.

Quit being a 3000GT Nutswinger.

Guy above me is smart, he knows whats bad about his car but still loves it.

Just cause I love LT1s doesnt mean Im gonna flip shit when people talk bad about them, they fail in comparison to an LS1 and the opti blows. I can say that but I still love them.

Black and white: the car is definitely worth at least $25k. Convertibles are insanely rare.

Gray area: I wouldn't buy that car for that much from a guy who drives like a tool. It'd have to be incredible dirt cheap for me to ever buy it from a douche. But thats what its worth to me. Someone else may say different and pay that amount to him.

I always observe an owner before considering purchasing a car. My car was an excellent price at $7500 for a 96 TSi AWD with 52k miles with only 2 owners. The guy I bought it from had had it for 7 years. He was a 45 year old guy with a wife and 3 kids, living in the suburbs. He had only put about 10k on the car in 7 years. It was a garage queen that only came out on sunny days above 70 degrees. lol. It had rained earlier the day I went to see the car. On my test drive, I thought the owner was going to have a stroke when I drove it through a puddle. LoL. This car had never been to a track or a dyno, nor ever raced or heavily modified. Perfect. Sold. :rotf: His whole family watched out the window when I told him I was buying it the same day, and drove away.

...did it ever state how many miles are on the car? i never saw that piece of information.

Trust me, I drive a Vr-4, with upwards of 430 HP. I run low 12's and have seen high 11's with drag radials.

430 horse should bring lower times than high 11's in a car. Otherwise, the platform sucks and/or is far too heavy/portly/fatassed to be a true automotive bit of excellence. (And to say it's built for more than just a straight line is a retarded argument, because there's no way that the VR4 is going to handle as well as a Fiero, MR2, Miata, or other lightweight, RWD vehicle.)

296 WHP yielded this 11.94 run in this FRONT WHEEL DRIVE GROCERY GETTER (http://www.cartuning.ca/images/subpages/media/1194_117_pass.wmv) on drag radials. (Right-click/save as, if you don't want to stream the video. For more information, visit cartuning.ca/media.php about the cartuning performance turbo kit.)

So - if you're being out-run by a street-trim turbo 3800 in a FRONT WHEEL DRIVE Pontiac Grand Prix (which runs 12.5 on street tires), then there's a chance the car sucks. Because the Grand Prix is considered a heavy, front-wheel-drive land barge. ;)

To call it a "supercar" from the 90's is a fallacy, and frankly ignorant.

Back on topic:
That car is NOT worth 25 G's. Especially with the way the vehicle was supposedly driven. And if you want any kind of handling performance from it, look to a different one. Convertibles suck at handling. (Frame twist and all that jazz.) The GT3k as a whole sucks at handling, but the convertible moreso. That car is too much of a "look at me" car, and nothing more. If you want performance, look to another platform. There's infinitely better AWD platforms, if you must use AWD. There's infinitely better RWD platforms if you want all-out performance. And if you're looking to spend 25 grand on a vehicle, pick up a Fiero, MR2, Miata, or older RX7 and build it for the same price, and kick the crap out of the GT3k in all trims, in terms of reliability, and in all forms of racing aside from rally. (Unless you get a different AWD vehicle, like an STi or an EVO. Then you'd even have it trumped there.)

Quick edit:
Hell - this 278-ish FWHP LUMINA is in the 12's. L67 Lumina LTZ (http://youtube.com/watch?v=bUddD-e0y-M&feature=user). You can't tell me that's not embarassing, to have your "Supercar from the 90's" being in the same class as a moderately tuned L67 4-door family car which hits mid-11's now on DR's. (The linked video is from a year ago, before the 2.7" pulley increased the supercharger's output and the computer was re-mapped to the new boost.)

...did it ever state how many miles are on the car? i never saw that piece of information.

nope. i was wondering the same thing when i first saw the listing. i'm guessing it's high enough for him to not want to flaunt it.

Well the only reason I say you have no idea what your babbling about is because you call the 3kGT slow, the car was running mid 13's straight out of the factory for under 40K in the 90's, where as some 100K lambo's and ferraris were still touching low to mid 13's.
I went back and read all my posts in this thread and couldnt find where I said they were slow. could you quote me?

you are such a :chad:

Yeah its true you guys are all free to your opinion and for the guy with the celica the problem is you cant say 400 some horses in the 11's is slow, not everone is looking to build a 6 second drag queen, yes weight is really important but if thats all you care about might as well drive a civic if weight is everything to you and make a fast car with 200fwhp or Fieros, or any lighter car because truly you can make it fast for little power but to some people a little bit more sports luxury is required, look at the NSX...

Yes the 3KGT is a little bit heavier than the other TT platforms of its time, but the car made up for it with its AWD, and luxury options, and in no means is it meant to be a drag car but they can easily be put in the 11's for around 3-5k. I agree $25,000 is a lot for that particular VR4 Spyder, but people who buy those cars are enthusiasts who love the rarity and platform. I mean people dish out 60-80K dollars for old muscle cars in stock form just because of how rare it is all the time.

I'm sorry if I offended anyone from my posts but I just throught it was rediculous how bad the car was getting bashed, I mean not everyone is going to agree with whats worth what and whats faster, but you guys were hating on it like it was a wannabe sports car made by Geo or something.

Anyways I'm not going to argue with everyone on this forum because its making me look like a 3KGT cyber freak at this point, I just hate hearing people always talk shit about these cars but its cool I dont care, one thing I just to say was calling it unreliable I mean yes they did have a transfer case recall which all dealers have to take care of, but my car is about to hit 160K miles now, simple maintance work, and its still running strong as they day it was driven off the dealership. So theres running proof that 3KGT are reliable when taken cared of....

You guys don't seem to get it. There were only a couple thousand 3kgt spyders made. It's not about how it performs or any crap like that, it's because it's a rare car. Kinda like how a firehawk commands a premium over a normal firebird or trans am, but rarer.

no one was "hating" on the 3kgt only facts were presented.

You guys don't seem to get it. There were only a couple thousand 3kgt spyders made. It's not about how it performs or any crap like that, it's because it's a rare car. Kinda like how a firehawk commands a premium over a normal firebird or trans am, but rarer.
except the 3kgt spyder is more like a special edition honda that only a few were made of, its not that great.

for it to be 25K i would say it would have low miles, all paper work, no dings anywhere, no inside damage, original paint with no faiding or paint chips, and basically be in perfect condition

the problem is you cant say 400 some horses in the 11's is slow

Yes you can, it's slow. See also - my previous post, with a Front-wheel-drive land barge of a daily-driven, streetable grocery-getter putting 296 horsepower to the wheels, running 11's. And that's slow. A 400 horsepower car in the 11's runs the same physical speed (11's in the 1/4) but it can be done with 296 front-wheel horsepower. So why should 400 horsepower running 11's on an AWD platform impress me if a POS FWD does the same with less power?

The fact that same car was being out-done by Turbo MR2's from the same time period, out-done by late-80's RX7's, and Miatas of the same years with some modification, made it an obsolete vehicle before it even got out of concept stage. Its excruciating weight, its turbo lag, its lack of reliability, and its suspension setup all were plagues upon the vehicle as a whole, and still are. If you dropped 1,000 pounds off its base curb weight, and gave it about 60 more horsepower, and swapped out the transfer case for a much more efficient/reliable one, then maybe it would be a car to consider.

Doesn't it logically follow that, if a FWD POS does 11's in the 1/4 with 296 WHP, then an even bigger pile of turds in terms of engineering would run the same time with more power? The VR4 is a poorly engineered, overweight, slow vehicle. Period. To call it a "Supercar" from Japan is the epitome of ignorance, and frankly, an insult to cars like the NSX, which, by the way, isn't a supercar if it can be kept up with by an all-iron-engine-swapped Fiero. (Look over on streetfire for the Putnam Park 3800-supercharged Fiero run. A daily-drivable, street-legal Fiero keeping up with a stripped, race-prepped, trailer-queer NSX.)

yes weight is really important but if thats all you care about might as well drive a civic if weight is everything to you and make a fast car with 200fwhp or Fieros, or any lighter car because truly you can make it fast for little power but to some people a little bit more sports luxury is required, look at the NSX...

200 front-wheel horsepower on a Fiero? I'm sorry, but my Fiero has 0 front wheel horsepower. It's a mid-engine'd, rear-wheel drive vehicle. And a Civic is by far the worst car to put into this comparison. It's not anywhere near the capacity of an MR2, Miata, RX7, Fiero, etc. As much as people wished it was.

As for "a little more sports luxury"... Mr. Mike's full leather-wraped interior kits for the Fiero give it all the luxury the VR4 doesn't have. There are interior kits for the MR2 that put its interior on the hand-built quality of their creators. My Fiero is lined up to have a full heads up display, a custom, hand-built carbon fiber/leather interior, in-dash car-computer, roughly 380-420 RWHP, weighing under 3,000 pounds, all costing less than $25,000. But you're totally right dude, the VR4 is such an amazing deal, with all its reliability problems, difficult-to-work-on components, overweight chassis, and barely mediocre drivetrain, with a power-to-weight ratio similar to a 1962 Cadillac DeVille, and just about the amount of performance technology to match. Just the car I need. :thumbsup:

Wow. Fanboyism = :chad:

Seriously, 4200 lbs without a driver stock, I have at least 200 lbs of stereo equipment, and I weigh about 185-190. Not to mention the horrible transfer case that has been reported to see power losses greater than 15%. I should clarify, on the dyno we made 2 runs. I have 478 HP to the flywheel and 231 to the wheels. If you ask me thats a significant loss from the drivetrain/transfer case, nearly 50 horsepower difference. Plus the stock rear gears (3.15's) suck for the quarter. As does the 6 speed transmission. Although I like my car, and It's alot more fun than almost all of my friends cars, If I could do it all over again I would have deffinately spent my 7k elsewhere, maybe somewhere my mods would have done more good. The only highlights of the 3kgt is the smooth ride, and with electronic all wheel steer, and electronic ride stability control It handles well at high speeds. The interior is full leather and comfortable, but as far as performance goes I could have a low 10 second foxbody or a northstar swapped fiero, and been much happier. But hey, mistakes help us learn I've deffinately learned not to listen to my friends as to what is a sweet car and what isn't.

Seriously, 4200 lbs without a driver stock,

Shit, that's even heavier than I thought it was. Ugh, that's right up there with one of the B-body Impalas! Not saying that they're not nice cars, but heavy is an understatement, and they need at least 700 RWHP to maintain their competitive nature.

296 WHP yielded this 11.94 run in this FRONT WHEEL DRIVE GROCERY GETTER (http://www.cartuning.ca/images/subpages/media/1194_117_pass.wmv) on drag radials. (Right-click/save as, if you don't want to stream the video. For more information, visit cartuning.ca/media.php about the cartuning performance turbo kit.)
The 296WHP was on a customers otherwise stock GP-GT car. The 11.94 run was made on their shop GP-GTP which (as you can read in the link you provided) has alot more mods and on SLICKS.

If the car was not lightened (as stated) and the guy running it actually weighed 260# (total 3800#) then the traps equate to ~450WHP.

As for the 3KGT being worth $25K, given it's rarity I'd say someone would likely pay that price. Not me.

The 296WHP was on a customers otherwise stock GP-GT car. The 11.94 run was made on their shop GP-GTP which (as you can read in the link you provided) has alot more mods and on SLICKS.

Never said it was only slicks. Stated it was a cartuning performance turbo L36 3800. Turbo 3800. No 3800 came stock turbo'd since the Grand National, and that's not even considered a 3800. Man, you really suck at this reading before replying, don't you?

If a 3800 is dropping 296 horse to the wheel, when it's rated less than 210 at the crank, well, no shit, it's modded. But then again - the VR4 isn't putting 430 to the wheel stock either. So I was comparing modded vs. modded. He was saying how he made 430 horsepower and was in the high 11's on DR's. I simply pointed out that a heavy, FWD car that dynos on average around 296 front-wheel-horsepower is in the 11's/12's in the 1/4. The red one in the dyno video is dynoing exactly 296 wheel horsepower and 438 WTQ, and runs 12.7 on street tires.

Quick FYI: The limited-slip did little to nothing in terms of the 11-second run, and the only real difference in terms of modifications other than the LSD from the customer car was the 1.9:1 rocker arms and the intercooler. However, they were using an L67 motor with a gutted supercharger housing and the turbo conversion kit, using the standard turbo instead of the PT61. The L36 on the customer's car has a higher compression ratio, has a better turbo, and doesn't have the added weight/loss of the Inten$e-Racing LSD. (Most have found that, even though the stock differential causes one-wheel-wonder burnouts, it's actually more beneficial to leave in due to lack of power loss. The aftermarket LSD's for the 4t65HD have horrendous power loss percentages.) And seeing as it's an L36 GP, it's got better acceleration gearing than the L67 GP, which got 2.86 instead of the 3.29. But - clearly, the customer's car isn't going to come even remotely close to a low-12 1/4 time on street tires. ;)


If the car was not lightened (as stated) and the guy running it actually weighed 260# (total 3800#) then the traps equate to ~450WHP.

Once again - there are dyno tests everywhere around the net showing cars with similar modifications at 296-300 WHP, not 450. Most do exceed 430 WTQ though. The 3800 does not gather its speed from amazing high-revving horsepower numbers, however gains a lot of ground sub-5000 RPM over competing engines (like GM's 3.4 DOHC motor.)

And the dyno sheet for the Lumina video posted was at the MonteMadness meet last time, and showed a 280 WHP vehicle, which runs 12's consistently without the cartuning performance turbo kit, but rather a modified L67. He was running high-12's/13's flat prior to the change to a 2.7" pulley. In fact, the dyno sheet prior to the change to the 2.7" pulley is a corrupt image. >.<; (I'll edit this post when he re-e-mails me the image.) But - showed him at almost 280/310 horse/torque at the wheels. The change to the 2.7" pulley put him to 360 WHP and high-11's with DR's. He has the same 3.29 transmission gearing as the customer's GP, and manages those times without the turbo. And we all know the turbo kit from CTP is significantly more efficient than the stock M90 supercharger on the L67.

Seriously, 4200 lbs without a driver stock, I have at least 200 lbs of stereo equipment, and I weigh about 185-190. Not to mention the horrible transfer case that has been reported to see power losses greater than 15%. I should clarify, on the dyno we made 2 runs. I have 478 HP to the flywheel and 231 to the wheels
You're math does not add up. Your 231WHP with 20% drivetrain loss would equate to 289FWHP. Where are you getting 478FWHP? That's near 50% drivetrain loss which means either you have one screwed up car or the dyno guy put in the wrong drivetrain calibration. What do you trap in the 1/4 mile?

Also per Team3S FAQ (http://www.team3s.com/FAQ-Specs1.htm) stock 3KGT/Stealth TTs topped out at 3800# stock.

If you're looking for more performance and still want to have a good looking car, 3SX Racing (http://www.3sx.com/racing/) is prol one of the best resources out there. They recently put down 9.3@159 on their shop AWD (~900WHP).

Oh and don't listen to all the e-posers here that drive fictional cars or those with real (slow) cars that feel the need to make up for their impotance by knocking on everyone else's... the VR4/StealthTTs are sweet cars :icon12:

Oh and don't listen to all the e-posers here that drive fictional cars or those with real (slow) cars that feel the need to make up for their impotance by knocking on everyone else's... the VR4/StealthTTs are sweet cars :icon12:

I've shown pictures of my cars plenty of times. Hell - they're in the garage here if you'd bother to go look, smart-ass. :rolleyes:

I've shown videos of supposedly shitty FWD grocery-getters outperforming from 0-1320 feet. As for 9's:
Grand Prix GTP turbo (http://youtube.com/watch?v=tzM2Gytw4rQ)

ZZP Grand Prix GTP. A FWD platform can do it too. 9.01@150.5 ;) Sorry, but the VR4 is just not a great car. It's great in the same way a B-body Impala is great.

Oh and don't listen to all the e-posers here that drive fictional cars or those with real (slow) cars that feel the need to make up for their impotance by knocking on everyone else's
and you dont consider yourself one of these people? If anything you are the only person like this that has posted in this thread

You're math does not add up. Your 231WHP with 20% drivetrain loss would equate to 289FWHP. Where are you getting 478FWHP? That's near 50% drivetrain loss which means either you have one screwed up car or the dyno guy put in the wrong drivetrain calibration. What do you trap in the 1/4 mile?

Also per Team3S FAQ (http://www.team3s.com/FAQ-Specs1.htm) stock 3KGT/Stealth TTs topped out at 3800# stock.

If you're looking for more performance and still want to have a good looking car, 3SX Racing (http://www.3sx.com/racing/) is prol one of the best resources out there. They recently put down 9.3@159 on their shop AWD (~900WHP).

Oh and don't listen to all the e-posers here that drive fictional cars or those with real (slow) cars that feel the need to make up for their impotance by knocking on everyone else's... the VR4/StealthTTs are sweet cars :icon12:
431 to the wheels, my bad, it's a typo lol

Never said it was only slicks
You said he ran the 11.94 time on DRs, I corrected you and from your own link said it was SLICKs :wavey:

I'd also speculate with high probability that the shop also has an aftermarket tork converter/trans mods they are not mentioning. Regardless, it's a fast car, but I'm sure that Shop car is making much more power.

And looking at one of their client's testimonials:

I can't say enough about Cartuning performance. The Turbo kit is amazing; my only regret is not having installed it sooner. It took my otherwise stock 150HP Pontiac Grand Prix GT to an amazing 338WHP non intercooled in a "Saturday afternoon "
The shop car is a modified car with an intercooler. I'd HOPE that it made more than 338WHP.

431 to the wheels, my bad, it's a typo lol

Ahh.. more like it. That's a decent amount of power for a street car.. at least it is in mine, though mine's a bit more svelt :biggrin:

60' 1.638
1/8 7.4020@97.15
1/4 11.442@122.56
is an average run on DR's with 431 HP to the wheels, Not very impressive but it is what it is.

This is on stock gears. Only mods I have are bigger injectors, 14g turbo upgrade, custom CAI, Custom 3" Borla exhaust, reflash, and H/C (Cams are just a tad more aggressive than stock, but not much. They make it have a little of a loaping sound, though I think that mostly comes from the exhaust.) EDIT* forgot BOV and Manual Boost Controller.

and you dont consider yourself one of these people? If anything you are the only person like this that has posted in this thread
I see you're eating paint chips again :headscrat

Do you even have a car (or are old enough to drive one)?

60' 1.638
1/8 7.4020@97.15
1/4 11.442@122.56
is an average run on DR's with 431 HP to the wheels, Not very impressive but it is what it is
For a ~4200# luxury GT that's respectable as hell. Though 122traps seems a bit high for 431WHP and your weight.

they say 3800# stock, but thats on an empty tank and I'm sure no other fluids, I know it's way closer to 41/4200. Meh, it's alright could be better.

This thread makes me want to puke...

It's seriously pointless to argue with some of the members on this thread, as said earlier yes weight is an issue with the VR4, but the car is reliable if kept that way, and despite how much XX amount of power is needed, but it is very possible to have the 3KGT in the low 9's just with 3.7 stroker and a big turbo upgrade, or TWIN. Yes the awd is a major factor but with slicks and stripped down it can easily keep up with many trailer queens (NOT ALL TRAILER QUEENS), but some it will give a good run if not beat....

I believe the record right now is 1/4 9.2, which isin't bad for a barely .2 bore without full boost potential. In the near future were going to start seeing a trend for some 8 second 3KGT arrising from major 3KGT specialty shops, which is nothing special or trophy worthy but def. shows the platform for a V6 is able to make some serious times and power....

you can make any car fast with enough money :biggrin:

3000gt's are garbage. needs a diet and a reliable drivetrain

I believe the record right now is 1/4 9.2, which isin't bad for a barely .2 bore without full boost potential. In the near future were going to start seeing a trend for some 8 second 3KGT arrising from major 3KGT specialty shops, which is nothing special or trophy worthy but def. shows the platform for a V6 is able to make some serious times and power....

I can't believe I'm wasting my lunch break to respond to this, but... if 9.2 is the record for the VR4, doesn't that then follow that the ZZP Turbo Grand Prix on a 3800 V6 running 9.01@150.05 is a faster platform? (Even though it is a FWD vehicle?) I mean - to hit 9.01@150.05, the ZZP Turbo Grand Prix is using a stock-cubed, built 3800 Series-II V6. Car number 449 on the time-slip below.
http://www.dragtimes.com/images_timeslip/10619-1997-Pontiac-Grand-Prix-Timeslip.jpg

There's also the 8-second 3800-powered F-body that's floating around too. Doesn't need AWD to reach that time. Here's a video of said 3800 series-2 V6 reaching 8's in the 1/4. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uav0dc-Lpg) And the engine is in no way built to the extreme that the 9.01 second Grand Prix's 3800 is. If it were, that car would be in the 7's. Especially if gutted as much as the Grand Prix was. But hey, the 3kGT is a great car, right? :thumbsup:

Quick edit before anyone decides to nit-pick.
The Intense-Racing 3800-powered F-body is fully built and twin-turbo'd, but it is not dropping the same amount of power to the wheels the 9.01 second GP is, and still has more of the stock body/interior metal than the GP does. It's still stock-cubed though.

I can't believe I'm wasting my lunch break to respond to this, but... if 9.2 is the record for the VR4, doesn't that then follow that the ZZP Turbo Grand Prix on a 3800 V6 running 9.01@150.05 is a faster platform? (Even though it is a FWD vehicle?)
Seriously who the **** cares. This thread was about the 3KGT not the GM3800 :shakehead

Seriously who the **** cares. This thread was about the 3KGT not the GM3800 :shakehead

Thank you, yeah were not sitting here comparing whats a better car for dragging, we were just stating that the 3kGT is capable of running great 1/4 times, and can be reliable such as my car thats hitting 160K miles without any problems.

Theres no need to compare whats faster with what done to it, I'm just responding to the posts that 3KGT are barely capapble of running 11's, yet there are some in the 9's and very soon the 8's 1/4 wise.

Thank you, yeah were not sitting here comparing whats a better car for dragging, we were just stating that the 3kGT is capable of running great 1/4 times, and can be reliable such as my car thats hitting 160K miles without any problems.

Theres no need to compare whats faster with what done to it, I'm just responding to the posts that 3KGT are barely capapble of running 11's, yet there are some in the 9's and very soon the 8's 1/4 wise.
those arent that great of times you know..

is vr4 the one with aws??

is vr4 the one with aws??
yes

.

how many cars are there with awd, aws, hard top vert??
1.
no wonder it goes for 25g,

Seriously who the **** cares. This thread was about the 3KGT not the GM3800 :shakehead

Fact is, there are better engines/platforms out there, and the 3kGT is an overweight, over-priced, over-hyped vehicle. I'm not much for bias towards import or domestic, I'd gladly take an RX7, Miata, MR2, or 240sx if given to me as a project vehicle. Hell - my ideal project would be a 3rd-gen MR2 with much modification. (Light weight, good power-weight ratio, stiffest chassis under 500 pounds other than the Lotus Elise/Exige you're going to find, great suspension geometry out of the box, better if you play with some of the more extreme suspension kits.) The 3kGT is in no way a "supercar" as has been stated, and calling it as such insults true super-cars. The justification? The L36/L67 and the cars they came in. A modified L36 F-body not only can out-accelerate a similarly modified 3kGT, but I'd venture to say, with the right suspension modifications, and its lighter weight stock-for-stock, it would have no problem driving circles around the 3kGT as well. I mean - seriously, if an F-Body, of all mundane things, is capable of the same or better performance numbers with a common V6, then chances are, the car in question isn't a super-car. Yeah - in comparison to a Civic, any Daihatsu, a Suzuki Swift, a Honda Fit, the 3kGT is a supercar, but put it up next to an NSX-T, upper-end Lamborghini, upper-end Ferrari, upper-end Noble, or any other REAL supercar, and it takes a nose-dive in comparison. This thread is made of fanboyism and fail. Shane was right, fanboyism is :chad:.

Oh and don't listen to all the e-posers here that drive fictional cars or those with real (slow) cars that feel the need to make up for their impotance by knocking on everyone else'sWho would you be referring to there? I know it's not me. Just making sure there e-thug. You should take you own advice you know?

Cyco

Who would you be referring to there? I know it's not me. Just making sure there e-thug. You should take you own advice you know?

Cyco
watch out! now he is going to ask you your age and if you have a car.

It's like arguing with a bunch of 4 year olds which hotwheels is better, it doesn't matter, its basically a matter of opinion, and I'm sure some of your cars are well worthy of power, but all I was saying was VR4 are not that bad of cars and some VR4's maybe overpriced, but for 10K-15K is well worth it too MANY MANY PEOPLE.....

Actually I know a handful of people that would kill to pick up a good condition VR4 for that price range.

It's like arguing with a bunch of 4 year olds which hotwheels is better, it doesn't matter, its basically a matter of opinion, and I'm sure some of your cars are well worthy of power, but all I was saying was VR4 are not that bad of cars and some VR4's maybe overpriced, but for 10K-15K is well worth it too MANY MANY PEOPLE.....

Actually I know a handful of people that would kill to pick up a good condition VR4 for that price range.
tell your friends to check out ebay if they want a stock vr4 in that price range.

tell your friends to check out ebay if they want a stock vr4 in that price range.

Yeah for that price range you'll find them on EBAY, but uhh how reliable of a source is that???

When your dealing with a car that is very expensive to repair you want to make sure its in tip top shape, and anyone selling a car cheap has a reason especially on EBAY.

Side Note: I'm not saying you can't find a good deal on EBAY because there are but at the same time there are many scammers, and shady sellers on there as well.

Call me old fashioned but I like to see the vehicle in person and drive it before I fork over thousands of dollars.

I agree with you on the ebay part, but people that I know that buy cars off of ebay they dont pay for the car until they see it

It's like arguing with a bunch of 4 year olds which hotwheels is better, it doesn't matter, its basically a matter of opinion, and I'm sure some of your cars are well worthy of power, but all I was saying was VR4 are not that bad of cars and some VR4's maybe overpriced, but for 10K-15K is well worth it too MANY MANY PEOPLE.....

Actually I know a handful of people that would kill to pick up a good condition VR4 for that price range.All I have to say is, those people you are referring to are all ricers.

All I have to say is, those people you are referring to are all ricers.
+1 completely agree. Shit i got my 05 GTO with 15k miles for $21,000. LS2 and everything with 400hp. sorry but 3kgt for 25,000 is ****ing ridiculous i don't care how rare it is. Its over 10 years old too and probably has over 100k miles. might as well buy a freakin evo for that price

+1 completely agree. Shit i got my 05 GTO with 15k miles for $21,000. LS2 and everything with 400hp. sorry but 3kgt for 25,000 is ****ing ridiculous i don't care how rare it is. Its over 10 years old too and probably has over 100k miles. might as well buy a freakin evo for that price
i think you're statement is too broad, the only reason it is so expensive is because there were only so many made, most probably totaled, or have a lot of miles on it. if this car was actually in good shape then it could be the rare factor which is bumping it up so high. there are tons of other rare cars which are way more expensive than they should be

i think you're statement is too broad, the only reason it is so expensive is because there were only so many made, most probably totaled, or have a lot of miles on it. if this car was actually in good shape then it could be the rare factor which is bumping it up so high. there are tons of other rare cars which are way more expensive than they should be

it could also be the hype factor

how rare are they? i see them all the time

Who would you be referring to there? I know it's not me. Just making sure there e-thug. You should take you own advice you know?
Don't get your panties in a bunch, I think you know to whom I was referring.

watch out! now he is going to ask you your age and if you have a car.
I'm sure he can read my sig/profile. Now go back to your paintchips.

for 10K-15K is well worth it too MANY MANY PEOPLE.....

WTF? I bought mine for 7k with 65k miles on it 2 years ago, Guy had it in his garage and just stopped driving it when he had a kid. It had a custom CAI w/ heat shield, manual boost controller, BOV, Custom 3" borla exhaust when I bought it, and I STILL ONLY PAYED 7k. If I could do it again I still say I would have bought something different. Honestly the people you are talking about are exactly as I was when I bought this car, uneducated and easily convinced something is better than it is. Which is not hard to do when someone knows little to nothing about what they are buying. Anyway, coming from someone who owns a VR4, the potential is stunted to say the least. Drivetrain has little aftermarket for the components that matter (transmission/transfer case, since the stock ones suck). Handling is good for a 4200# car, if it wasn't so bloated it would handle a hell of a lot better, that's for sure. IMO I could have bought a fiero done an ls1 swap for the ammount of money I've put into this car, or built a s/c foxbody. Seriously guys, it's a fun car, but if you are planning on modding a car don't buy a 3kgt, it's not worth your money.

WTF? I bought mine for 7k with 65k miles on it 2 years ago, Guy had it in his garage and just stopped driving it when he had a kid. It had a custom CAI w/ heat shield, manual boost controller, BOV, Custom 3" borla exhaust when I bought it, and I STILL ONLY PAYED 7k. If I could do it again I still say I would have bought something different. Honestly the people you are talking about are exactly as I was when I bought this car, uneducated and easily convinced something is better than it is. Which is not hard to do when someone knows little to nothing about what they are buying. Anyway, coming from someone who owns a VR4, the potential is stunted to say the least. Drivetrain has little aftermarket for the components that matter (transmission/transfer case, since the stock ones suck). Handling is good for a 4200# car, if it wasn't so bloated it would handle a hell of a lot better, that's for sure. IMO I could have bought a fiero done an ls1 swap for the ammount of money I've put into this car, or built a s/c foxbody. Seriously guys, it's a fun car, but if you are planning on modding a car don't buy a 3kgt, it's not worth your money.

+1 not worth to mod unless your not looking for anything more than a good daily driver 10-11 second car at best.

+1 not worth to mod unless your not looking for anything more than a good daily driver 10-11 second car at best.
Well said :biggrin:

+1 not worth to mod unless your not looking for anything more than a good daily driver 10-11 second car at best.
Ionno Reliability becomes a huge issue for the drivetrain on 3kgt's once you get into the 10's/11's. I wouldn't call it D/d but a good weekend car. My D/d is my cbr6000 f4i, I only drive the 3kgt when it freezes, other than that i ride my bike, even in washingtons rainy weather.

+1 completely agree. Shit i got my 05 GTO with 15k miles for $21,000. LS2 and everything with 400hp. sorry but 3kgt for 25,000 is ****ing ridiculous i don't care how rare it is. Its over 10 years old too and probably has over 100k miles. might as well buy a freakin evo for that price
My bro just bought a 07 gto and iam not impressed ,besides it looks like any other pontiac driving down the road 25,000 is a good price for a rare imported vr4 in good condtion and being a hard top conv ,i have seen members make remarkes about it being to heavy yet i ll take out any lt1 or mustang gt ( stock to stock ) street racing and oh yeah that wont look like everyone elses car driving down th road . The whole weight thing make me laugh :biggrin: oh yeah your honda weighs less then my car but iam faster and can take on most american car in collisions if i get in a accident and still walk away can your civics,crx,or rx7 can they do that ? probebly not .The drivetrain in mine is 16 years old now the only thing i have do to is change the oil flush the fluids ,changed the timming belt and clutch .every car goes throught this if you take care of it . I know plenty of american overpriced car less years then mine and are on to there second engines or trannies by now

Freakin ricers...

Freakin ricers...
Well Said..

My bro just bought a 07 gto and iam not impressed ,besides it looks like any other pontiac driving down the road 25,000 is a good price for a rare imported vr4 in good condtion and being a hard top conv ,i have seen members make remarkes about it being to heavy yet i ll take out any lt1 or mustang gt ( stock to stock ) street racing and oh yeah that wont look like everyone elses car driving down th road . The whole weight thing make me laugh :biggrin: oh yeah your honda weighs less then my car but iam faster and can take on most american car in collisions if i get in a accident and still walk away can your civics,crx,or rx7 can they do that ? probebly not .The drivetrain in mine is 16 years old now the only thing i have do to is change the oil flush the fluids ,changed the timming belt and clutch .every car goes throught this if you take care of it . I know plenty of american overpriced car less years then mine and are on to there second engines or trannies by now
ok, you beat them stock to stock. all the cars you listed are 4 bangers that come stock N/A. Lt1 stock runs no boost... you run twins stock. Put TT on a 3800 series II with only mods to make the engine be able to hold up the boost and it will walk you. put even a single turbo on an lt1 and it will walk you. Trust me you have to look at things like that. I can take out alot of N/A v8's stock for stock, but give them the same technology that's in your motor and you get whooped. It's sad that it takes Twin Turbos to make 330 hp out of a v6. Seriously I think I have the best DSM/Mitsubishi in general on the forums and It seems as though I'm the only unsatisfied one. Seriously, this forum and ls1tech have changed me from a ricer to someone with an actual knowledge about cars... I'm sorry you haven't found your ricer cure yet. It will come with time.. I hope.

these "what ifs" for the potential for v8's :eyeroll:

if he doesn't understand that, then he's beyond help.

but in the real world, your possible motor upgrades don't mean shit if they're not on there

in the real world, your possible motor upgrades don't mean shit if they're not on there
Or if they aren't used to their potential (e.g. the 14sec driver in a 10-sec car syndrome).

Funny story, a local in a well modified 11-sec S/C Cobra SVT races a bone stock 13-sec GTO. Guess who wins (hint: not the Cobra)?

Honestly if you have a consistant mid 12-sec street car, you're quicker than 99.999% of the cars on the road. That other .001% are broken down into similarly consistant street cars (10%) and those street cars that are rarely seen due to disrepair, excuses (too cold/hot/dry/wet/full moon..etc) and/or are trailor queens (90%).

Or if they aren't used to their potential (e.g. the 14sec driver in a 10-sec car syndrome).

Funny story, a local in a well modified 11-sec S/C Cobra SVT races a bone stock 13-sec GTO. Guess who wins (hint: not the Cobra)?

Honestly if you have a consistant mid 12-sec street car, you're quicker than 99.999% of the cars on the road. That other .001% are broken down into similarly consistant street cars (10%) and those street cars that are rarely seen due to disrepair, excuses (too cold/hot/dry/wet/full moon..etc) and/or are trailor queens (90%).

Well Said ^^^^^^

In theory many of those drag cars are so great, but how often does anyone see them or drive them on the road, pointless to even compare to the stock 3KGT, all it is a AWD heavy beat that can still be put in the 10's and still be a daily driver.

People blow $50,000-60,000 for a new Shelby Mustang, for $25,000 you get a AWD SPYDER Hard Top, for less than half the cost, and pretty much runs same time 1/4 mile with BPU, granted the 3KGT has more miles, but you can pick up close to nothing miles VR4 for about $25,000-30,000.

Or lets talk about weight look at all the old school muscle cars, they make the 3KGT look like a anorexic supermodel. People dish out well over 30K for those muscle cars... Listen all I am saying is that it's not just "hyped up ricers" that are overpriced as well...