:cool: BMW today released new details on its much-rumored N54 Bi-Turbo Engine. The motor is expected to appear in the 2007 BMW 335i and 2007 BMW 335ci (coupe). The engine has an output of 306 horsepower and maximum torque of 400 Nm. BMW said it has already tested a 3-Series sedan with the engine, and achieved a 0-62mph time of 5.7 seconds. BMW said the engine is relatively lightweight — about 70kg less than its 4.0-liter V8 engine. According to the automaker, the 3.0-liter engine has little or no turbo lag, thanks to two small turbos instead of one large one. Maximum torque is achieved between 1500 and 5800 rpm. What we know so far: BMW will show its new E92 3-Series coupe at the Geneva Motor Show along with this new engine. What's no entirely clear is whether this engine will make it to North America. Recent rumors suggested this turbo engine would be exclusive to Europe, and a different naturally-aspirated powerplant would drive the 335 in North America.

Good Job BMW but you haven't created an engine better than th LS2 V8

Impressive output for sure....

Really? How do you figure. I'm just saying, 306 HP out of a 3.0 twin-turbo is not exactly setting any records. Toyota made 320 HP 15 years ago with the Supra 3.0 twin-turbo. As did Mitsubishi and Nissan. All running 3.0 twin turbos. I can't seem to think why they would do that, the engine HAS to have way more potential than that. I'm not bagging on it, I'm just a little surprised and dissapointed at the output.

Cyco

So they've abandoned plans to call the E96 coupe the 4-Series?

LOL@this discussion. This is no HP/Liter debate, but the BMW inlines are known for their inpeccable smooth run and wide torque band. With this twin-turbo low pressure set-up they probably made another award winning engine.

Obviously they didn't went for an all out performance engine. BMW got 360hp out of an 3.2L straight 6 in their M3 CSL. That's 111 hp/liter, from an older engine.
LOL@comparing it to twin-turbo high pressure engines in some random japanese sports cars. 306hp in a sportive yet comfortable sedan is impressive, and more than enough. Different sorts for different applications....

BMW has shown e.g. with the V10 in the M5 how to built a real performance engine.

hi55us STFU

but the BMW inlines are known for their inpeccable smooth run and wide torque band. With this twin-turbo low pressure set-up they probably made another award winning engine.
:werd:

I'm sure if they wanted to this motor could push a lot more HP / TQ than it is right now, but that isn't their goal with the setup. I think it is a great setup for BMW enthusiasts who may want to play with it later on. But for the person who just buys one for a smooth fun ride, hats off to BMW for the motor how it sits.

What kind of powerband does this engine have? not peaky? really who gives a ****, you can get a better engine from GM cheaper and probably make more power while being smooth and running low octane fuel..

oh yeah, HP/litre is for ricers.

KNOCK IT OFF :angryfire

I'm not the gay one with the sissy earrings only degenerates and fags wear. I have nothing against gays, but please keep your inbred face out of this discussion if you have nothing to add. You and your butthole buddy are the demise of this forum if you keep continuing to act like a narrowheaded idiot.

oh yeah, HP/litre is for ricers.

Then Cyco must be a ricer as he was the one to start the discussion...

I'd appreciate if the guys that actually like this engine to keep posting about it and the haters stay away...

Hey! I've got earrings. :tongue:

I just like thick stainless steel protruding from my body. :rockon:

EDIT-
to stay on topic...where is the BMW motor that will utilize engine/coolant heat for more horsepower and MPG?

Will you guys stop coming onto each other lol.... jk

Cyco & HJ are going to take a different approach to their posts. I can assure you no one will flame you Lotus if you don't flame them. I've had long discussions with both of them already, peace should ensue unless you guys enjoy flaming each other and calling names, which in that case you can all continue and I won't intervene, but I don't want anyone crying to me later on lol.

Damn I really need to make a flame forum / free for all section and let you guys go at it.

And I agree with Lotus, if you guys don't like the motor and are only in the thread to bag on it, find another thread to praise the LSx motors or whatever else you want to compare it to. Don't continue to post in this one just to cause a fight.

I'm not crying. I give a **** about the approach Cyco & HJ seem to choose in their posts. I wasn't the one starting to "flame", but merely explained the purpose of this engine. Cyco was kind off reasonable in his appraoch, unfortunately Billy Bob HJ was the one acting like a braindead.

Oh, and it's kinda lame when posts are edited afterwards....

turbo bmw huh, I've been waiting for the day for bmw to give me a reason to finally purchase one of their cars...I'm sure the engine has more potential down the road with a turbo swap and some tuning

If you guys want to have it out, I'll leave it be. No problem, as long as it stays somewhat on topic about the motor in the end.

Will you guys stop coming onto each other lol.... jk
I can't help it he's attracted to me.. haha tell him to leave me alone, I don't want any.. haha

turbo bmw huh, I've been waiting for the day for bmw to give me a reason to finally purchase one of their cars...I'm sure the engine has more potential down the road with a turbo swap and some tuning

I don't think you even need to swap the turbo's, but fiddle with the electronics. I'm no expert though. I always liked the natural aspirated engines BMW offered.

Im sure just some tuning and opening up the exhaust to help it breathe better will make a big difference, but from the explenation it says they use smaller turbos so the lag is almost nill, great for say an auto-x setup, or for daily driving, but I'd rather have a to suffer a little bit of lag, and have some more pull up top

If you want that kind of performance you might better buy an M3.

LotusGT1,

I would appreciate it if you would NOT drag me into your instigations. I have said nothing derogatory or flaming in any way on this post. I also prefaced my comments with "this is only my opinion, but..." so I would appreciate it if you would stop trying to drag me into these debates because it's not doing anybody any good.

It is quite true that this engine makes very little power for what it is. I also chose no random cars, these were the "pinnacle" cars of the Japanese auto manufacturers 15 years ago. I also did not start this discussion, Mike did. So please, do not pull me in to your flame-fests anymore, I'm done with it.

I stick to my comment. This sounds like a very underpowered engine. Much like the Audi 2.7 BiTurbo was when it came out. That thing was a twin-turbo 2.7 liter V6 and only made 250 HP. That just seems like a waste of mechanical action there, when the engine, much like the BMW 3.0 that this post is all about, should be able to make that power smoothly, and reliably, naturally aspirated.

I am also well aware of what BMW can do from an engineering and power production standpoint, but we're not talking about that, we're talking about this. And first impressions, twin-turbo 3.0 I6, brand new engine, supposed to be really cool, and it produces "only" 306 HP. Well, my impression is that it is pretty weak, and that BMW has missed out on something here.

That is my opinion, and I think it's a pretty fair one.

Cyco

Exactly. I'm sorry, but reading your reply forced me to reply as I did.

I know what the BMW engines are capable of, and I think it is rather shitty of them to make an engine such as this, and then totally cripple them so they only make 306 or whatever horsepower.

That said, in america we buy things and expect we can 'tune' 'hot rod' or soup them up to make more power than they made off the lot. Why by an M3 when all the cool parts are interchangeable between any 3 series car {the E36 at least}, that has a lesser engine strapped in? Why not spend less money and build the 3 series to your liking, if thats what you want?

I don't know really. I'm certain you'll have something to say.

*edit* I have no interest in flaming you or any of these people. You want a discussion and you'll get one, but coming on to me or calling me a redneck, or worse dragging brent into this when what you really want is me.. that is unnecessary. So no thanks.

I'd rather get a vehicle equiped with this engine and work on the platform that has great potential. But that's just me

My goal was to own two E30 M3s. One restored to OE spec. The other built to the hilt racer (possible V8, not sure). This would have been an interesting swap as well. Like the S52(correct) being dropped in the E30. But they still cost way too much for me right now.

If you want that kind of performance you might better buy an M3.

True, considering the price of aftermarket parts for bmws, but that right there is what stops me from purchasing, I'm not the biggest fan of N/A cars, so although the M3 is a great car, price wise I'd rather go for say a cobra or the new gt500....And on top of that I could never drive a stock car, so I'd be modding the m3 anyways, and so I could save myself some money buy purchasing the 330 or 335 whatever this is going to be, and modding it, because I don't think the price of this car will reach m3 levels

Cyco, I'm not draggin you into any discussion, I merely stated to which post I responded, because Hjolter didn't grasp any of that (again). LOL, I even said your post was reasonable...

Mike didn't start any discussion concerning hp/liters, relative output or whatever. He merely posted the news this engine was introduced. YOU started about how the output is impressive or not. I merely stated the purpose BMW had in mind. YOU started to compare it some some random japanese sports cars. As said, different sorts for different applications...

BMW didn't go for an all out performance engine, but focussed on smooth run and wide torque band.

For the record, the US manufacturers are notorious for getting low output per litre, never heard you about that. I never cared, as they weren't built for that purpose, but you obviously seem to care...According to your logic the 8.0 liter V10 in the first Viper should get at least 800hp stock, as it would be a waste of mechanical action with the 450hp it produced.

You miss the point about which character the manufacturer wanted to give the engine. Again, it's not meant to be an all out performance engine.

EDIT - same applies to you HJ.

You miss the point about which character the manufacturer wanted to give the engine. Again, it's not meant to be an all out performance engine.
..that said, why not make more power? Probably so they don't compete powerwise with the M3, correct?

Because they could easily build a larger displacement engine that, turbocharged, could build more power and be as smooth. I'm talking 30 over and a tad more boost..

..that said, why not make more power? Probably so they don't compete powerwise with the M3, correct?


I'd say that is probably one of the reasons

OK. Fair enough. But then why turbocharge it? You should be able to get similar output from a naturally aspirated car. Plus the expense of the turbo system and all of that extra plumbing and what-not and you've just unnessessarily added complexity and cost to an already expensive car.

I am not trying to get into any kind of HP/liter conversation here. I NEVER get into conversations like that. I was pointing out that there are other engines out there, that were built to perform similarly to the BMW engine that produce more power in stock form and are over 15 years old already. THAT was the point. That this engine seemed to be behind technology that came out over 15 years ago.

As for a Viper, slap twin turbos on one, like the BMW engine, and see what happens. Hennessey makes a kit that produces a reliable 1000 HP. They even offer a 2 year 24000 mile warranty on it. The potential is there, and like HJ said, American cars are built to be modified.

The whole concept here is that I understand that they were looking to make a torquey daily driver engine. But it seems like a waste of reciprocating mass to me. I'm just stating an opinion, I'm not flaming, and I'm not trying to start an argument. I don't see what you get so worked up about. I just don't see why this engine is so impressive, as it is very unimpressive to me.

Cyco

OK. Fair enough. But then why turbocharge it? You should be able to get similar output from a naturally aspirated car. Plus the expense of the turbo system and all of that extra plumbing and what-not and you've just unnessessarily added complexity and cost to an already expensive car.
It keeps it more 'tame'. Pulling 300hp out of it N/A will wind it out more than what it's intended for.

I completely understand. But that makes this engine a bit "underwhelming" don;t you think? I bet this motor could make some serious power if "let loose" and I see the light with regard to BMW detuning this engine so as not to piss off any M3 owners. I think it would be a riot to build this motor up and go kick some M3 ass!

or just to spice things up a bit, everybody needs some marketing, esp for those who prefer cars that are supercharger or turbocharged like myself

I completely understand. But that makes this engine a bit "underwhelming" don;t you think? I bet this motor could make some serious power if "let loose" and I see the light with regard to BMW detuning this engine so as not to piss off any M3 owners. I think it would be a riot to build this motor up and go kick some M3 ass!
I haven't driven the car, so I really can't say. It probably could make some good power with good tuning. But with the new M3, there is now a V8 in that equation-more displacement. Though I can see it kicking off as a good 'tuner' and probbaly one of the easier to mod BMWs...maybe...